[27], Kenneth E. Bailey interprets the passage from a different perspective: he says that David's Jerusalem was tightly packed and Bathsheba's house may have been as close as twenty feet away from David's rooftop; people in ancient times were exceptionally modest about their bodies, so he suggests that Bathsheba displayed herself deliberately, so that instead of being an innocent victim, it was actually she who seduced David in order to rid herself of Uriah, and move in with King David. Hence, this appeal fails to prove that the two Eliams in 2 Samuel were different people. An older king could certainly have a younger counselor, and since early marriages were very common, it is not surprising for a 3040-year-old man to have grandchildren. [62] Later, Ahithophel was with Absalom in Jerusalem. This is not the Muslims problem because we do not believe in the Bible as a reliable source of information. The world was vastly different back then. 8 Then David told Uriah, Go down to your house and wash your feet., Uriah left the palace, and a gift from the king was sent after him. There are 2 videos refuting IC on Marys age. Nathan (son of David) - Wikipedia This tends to be the go-to argument for problematic verses. Once David took the bait, Nathan pronounced Gods judgment: This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: I anointed you king over Israel Why did you despise the word of the Lord by doing what is evil in his eyes? David's action was displeasing to the Israelite god Yahweh ('the Lord'), who sent Nathan the prophet to reprove the king. Morris Jastrow, Jr., Morris et al. This is not a matter of controversy. Bathsheba was the daughter of Eliam (2 Samuel 11:3, Ammiel in 1 Chronicles 3:5). It also means that she had married Uriah the Hittite at even earlier age. King David accepted this as his punishment, went to the house of Yahweh and worshipped him (2 Samuel 12:2023). The traditional ascription to David cannot on any ground be maintained. Thus, while some people (a, Even if we grant a new upper limit, 90 years, that does not improve the situation for embarrassed Christian apologists. Others may come to accept the evidence presented but will still attempt to downplay it. He founded the Judaean dynasty and united all the tribes of Israel under Christians should try to be consistent. The Woman Was Very Beautiful: The Shocking Truth About Bathshebas Marriage to David in the Bible, Originally posted on the Quran and Bible Blog, From the roof he saw a woman bathing. Several scholars see Bathsheba as the granddaughter of Ahitophel,[10] as do passages in the Talmud. he said "David was praying, when a beautiful bird appeared in front of him, and David left his prayer and went after the bird. While puberty could occur at such an early age, it is unlikely. [8] Rather than go home to his own bed, he preferred to remain with the palace troops. The name Eliam is only mentioned twice in the, But 1 Chronicles 11:36 gives the alternate name for Eliam, the son of Ahithophel as Ahijah the Pelonite, so he cannot be the same person as the father of Bathsheba!, Third, if Ahijah is an alternate name for Eliam, it still does not refute the claim that Eliam was the son of Ahithophel and the father of Bathsheba, simply because the Chronicler does not provide any additional information. It should be noted that the Bible does not state Bathsheba was _ years old. [81] https://www.biblestudytools.com/encyclopedias/isbe/ahithophel.html, [82] https://www.biblestudytools.com/concordances/naves-topical-bible/eliam.html, [83] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/eastons-bible-dictionary/eliam.html, [84] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/ats/a/ahithophel.html. WebIt is true that Davids affair with Bathsheba while her husband was at the battle front constituted adultery. [49], Among the Jewish commentaries besides the Talmud and the Targums, Rashi also identified Ahithophel as the subject of the psalm,[50] and this was also the view of the Pirkei Avot.[51]. with 2 Samuel 23:34)., [14] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bnb/2-samuel-11.html#3, Bath-sheba was the granddaughter of Ahithophel 2 Samuel 23:34., [15] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/bcc/2-samuel-12.html#1, He had no pity for the beautiful young Bathsheba whom he ordered to his bed. This could be shown with various degrees of nudity, depending on the pose and the placing of clothes or towels. Bathsheba | Description & Biblical Account | Britannica Before we begin, let us see what the Jewish scholars said about Bathshebas age when she gave birth to Solomon (dont worry, this is not the main evidence). David Some Bible dictionaries mention both Eliams without any additional information. Tomorrow Ill send you back. So Uriah stayed in Jerusalem that day. Using Psalm 55:23, it would mean that Ahithophel could not have gone past the age of 45 years (note again that this is the, Even if David slept with a 7-year old, that does not mean that God approved of it!, This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: I anointed you king over Israel Why did you despise the word of the Lord by doing, Notice that the sin was in killing Uriah the Hittite. David Bathsheba was a daughter of Eliam and was probably of noble birth. But you, God, will bring down the wicked into the pit of decay; Of course, the statement is not intended for a universal law, and indeed was probably pointed especially at the bloody and deceitful men of whom the psalmist had been speaking. [34] He is no longer able to control his family, and ends up being overthrown by Absalom. And Ahithophel began to counsel Absalom on how to destroy David. [74] https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H5288&t=KJV, [75] https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H7390&t=KJV, [76] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jfu/2-chronicles-24.html#15, [79] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque. King David's Wives and Marriages in the Bible - Learn The adultery scandal and the subsequent revolt by Absalom and Ahithophel would have required a clarification, but only if the author meant to refer to different people. [71] After returning to Jerusalem, Absalom lived there for another 2 years. And Allah (Glorified and Exalted be He) knows best! Hebraicae, in loco), the father of Bath-sheba. The estimation of Bathshebas age is indeed based primarily on the interpretation of Psalm 55, and especially verse 23 (see objection #2 below). He attempted to usurp the throne during the life of David (1 Kings 1:11ff). In fact, the ages of women are not mentioned except in a few places (e.g., the age of Sarah when she gave birth to Isaac). Web24 Then David comforted his wife Bathsheba, and he went to her and made love to her. and Ali Al-Ridha said "At that time, women whose husbands passed away or got killed in the war would never get married again (and this was the source of many evils). How old was Bathsheba When David married her? "[4] According to Michael D. Coogan, the faulting of David is made clear in the text from the very beginning: "It was springtime, the time when kings go forth to war but David remained in Jerusalem" (2 Samuel 11:1); if David had been away at war, the incident would not have taken place. The name Eliam is only mentioned twice in the entire Bible, and both instances occur in 2 Samuel. Indeed, this is highly unlikely given that Barzillai the Gileadite, who was 80 years old at the time of the revolt and was a supporter of David, was not willing to cross the Jordan river with David to go to Jerusalem from Mahanaim after Absaloms defeat and death because he was too old.[65]. Hushai the Arkite was the kings confidant. Bathsheba 1 From the passage itself (2 Samuel 12:15b-23), once he was born the child immediately was struck with the sickness and died on the 7th day. Why Was Abishag so Important to King David and WebAlthough David married numerous women in the course of his lifetime, he never bypassed the limits imposed by the Torah . But as for me, I trust in you.. Heb. Bathsheba's son, King Solomon, rises to greet her, bows down in veneration, and furnishes her a seat at his right hand. David and Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11:1-4) Introduction When my Grandmother Palmer was alive, she lived on a farm outside of Shelton, Washington. Ellicotts Commentary for English Readers not only questions this interpretation but also the traditional assumption of Davidic authorship: Its date and authorship must be left in the region of mere conjecture. [16] Bathsheba acts as intercessor for her subjects, delivering their petitions to the King: "Pray ask King Solomonhe will not refuse youto give me Abishag the Shunammite as my wife". Using Psalm 55:23, it would mean that Ahithophel could not have gone past the age of 45 years (note again that this is the conservative estimate). Was it not inspired? WebFrom the roof he saw a woman bathing. Bathsheba later gave birth to David's son Solomon. [63] Finally, he returned to Giloh and hanged himself after Absalom failed to take his advice. Moreover, according to the, Ahijah the Pelonite appears in 2 Samuel 23:34 as Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite, of which, But David was not a role model for all times! Thus, they were following the Jewish customs of the time, which included marriage at around 12 years of age for girls. When David was dying, Bathsheba successfully conspired with the prophet Nathan to block Adonijahs succession to the throne and to win it for Solomon. Satan is depicted as coming in the disguise of a bird. The son of Ahithophel (2 Samuel 23:34)., [93] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/2-samuel/11-3.html, Bath-sheba, the daughter of Eliam or Ammiel (1 Chronicles 3:5), one of Davids worthies (2 Samuel 23:34), and son of Ahithophel., [94] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/ckb/a/ahithophel.html, According to the Midrash, Ahithophel was Batshebas grandfather., [95] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/p/pelonite.html, [96] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hbd/p/pelonite.html, [97] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hdb/p/pelonite.html, [98] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/p/pelonite.html, [105] http://m.qtafsir.com/Surah-An-Nisa/Giving-Back-the-Property-of-th, Tagged as: 2 Samuel, Absalom, Age of consent, Ahithophel, Bathsheba, Bible, Child Marriage, David, Eliam, Psalm 55, par excellence. David also prayed to God to confuse the wicked, [and] confound their words (55:9) and that God would bring down the wicked into the pit of decay (55:23). He identified Ahithophel in the commentary on verse 12: Ahithophels perfidy and villany troubled David more than all the rest., [40] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/pulpit/psalms/55.htm, the general sentiment of commentators has always been that Ahithophel is intended. JazahAllahu Khair for your hard word we learn so much from you, Was iyyak. This was especially the case in France.[36]. And Im about to make articles as a form of ultimate refutations to your silly allegations. Rather, David laments being betrayed by: a man like myself, my companion, my close friend, with whom I enjoyed sweet fellowship[28]. Based on the example of Barzillai, 80 years seems to have been the upper limit of life in Davids time. King David [73] The reason for this is that it used the incorrect Hebrew text for 2 Samuel 15:7 (at the end of forty years), but the correct reading should be at the end of 4 years, as explained by Barnes: [a]n obvious clerical error, though a very ancient one for four years, which may date from Absaloms return from Geshur, or from his reconciliation with David, or from the commencement of the criminal schemes. hmm wasnt Bathsheba married before she was pregnant with Solomon and also didnt she also lose a child before giving birth to Solomon I mean come on abduls Indeed, the account in 2 Samuel 1517 shows a man who was quite active, thereby suggesting that he was not an old man. And test the orphans [in their abilities] until they reach marriageable age. [] Altogether it seems to us to relate to that mournful era when the King was betrayed by his trusted counsellor., [34] https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/smith_chuck/c2000_Psa/Psa_051.cfm?a=533001, Now David evidently wrote this psalm when he was fleeing from Absalom. Father of Bathsheba, whose first husband was a Hittite, 1 Samuel 11:3 (= 1 Chronicles 3:5 , where Eliam is called Ammiel ). Actually, God had no problem with it. David had multiple wives already, and Bathsheba was married to Uriah Bathsheba was uncovered (bathing) within sight of the palace, and should have known Psychologist Dr. Robert Epstein has made the controversial suggestion that young people, regardless of how young, should be allowed to make decisions about marriage and sex provided that they demonstrate that he or she knows about the risks of sexis physically and emotionally mature, and so on[99] He also suggests that they should have to pass one or more appropriate competency tests. Rather, my argument is that there was nothing Biblically wrong or immoral about Muhammads marriage to Aisha and that it was common practice in virtually all cultures for people to marry young (usually by the onset of puberty). you have contributed so much great eye opening articles making Muslims and Christians aware of such controversial subjects. Absalom calculated on his adhesion from the first (2 Samuel 15:12); the history does not directly say why, but incidentally it comes out: he was father of Eliam (or by transposition Ammiel, 1 Chronicles 3:5), the father of Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11:3; 2 Samuel 23:34; 2 Samuel 23:39)., [9] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hbd/a/ahithophel.html, He may have been the grandfather of Bathsheba, Davids partner in sin and wife, [10] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/hdb/a/ahithophel.html, Being Bathshebas grandfather, he had been alienated by Davids criminal conduct, [11] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/mbd/a/ahithophel-.html, A Gilonite, grandfather of Bathsheba, and a very wise counsellor of David, [12] https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/rpd/a/ahithophel.html, Some have endeavored to account for Ahithophels treason by the supposition that, as it seems likely he was Bath-shebas grandfather, he wished to revenge on David the evil done to her. Bathsheba and David Practically, I have helped the authors of DTT website and after I have done that, Im gonna deal with websites like wikiIslam and answering islam. Sons of David Bathsheba, also known as Bathshua, is a character that appears in the Hebrew Bible (2 Samuel 11, 12; 1 Kings 1, 2). Although Nathan is the third son raised by David and Bathsheba, he is the fourth born to Bathsheba. Figure 1: Map showing how far Ahithophel would have travelled in the short-lived coup attempt by Absalom. How[c] could I go home and eat, drink, and have sex with my wife? At the entrance to her driveway was a small lot, where a small mobile home was parked. for so we find with David, king of Israel, who learned from Ahitophel no more than two things, yet called him his master, his guide and his beloved friend, as it is said, But it was you, a man mine equal, my guide and my beloved friend (Psalms 55:14)., [52] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-23.htm, [53] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-23.htm, [54] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/gill/psalms/55.htm, [55] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jtc/psalms-55.html#23, [56] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/clarke/psalms/55.htm, So we find, if there be an appointed time to man upon earth, beyond which he cannot pass; yet he may so live as to provoke the justice of God to cut him off before he arrives at that period; yea, before he has reached half way to that limit. In this article. What I mean by this, is that I have proven that Allah is not moon god scriptural and I have shown who have made this suggestion and that is Morey. Hehehe, you guys are really funny. In addition, Gills Exposition of the Entire Bible explains, based on the Talmudic interpretation, that (emphasis ours): bloody and deceitful mendo not come up to the half of the ordinary term of mans life, which is threescore years and ten.[54], Heb. Psalm 55 is a prayer of David asking God to save him from his enemies. word was brought to him [David] that Ahithophel had gone over to the side of Absalom, [49] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/eastons-bible-dictionary/ahithophel.html, brother of insipidity or impiety, a man greatly renowned for his sagacity among the Jews. However, this does not appear to be a reasonable assumption. The evidence in question comes from the infamous marriage of David and Bathsheba. However, that is, Perhaps Eliam the son of Ahithophel the Gilonite is different from Eliam, the father of Bathsheba.. A hadith quoted in Tafsir al-Kabir and Majma' al-Bayan expresses that Ali ibn Abi Talib said: "Whoever says that David, has married Uriah's wife as the legends are narrate, I will punish him twice: one for qazf (falsely accusing someone of adultery) and the other for desecrating the prophethood (defamation of prophet David)". Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. WebHe was a younger brother of Shammuah (sometimes referred to as Shammua or Shimea), Shobab, and Solomon. Moreover, I showed that when Jesus was a 12-year old boy, his parents took him to the Passover festival, as the law required for boys his age. The norm that the ulama did come to consensus on was only a general guideline: they prohibited sexual intercourse for girls not able to undergo it, on the basis that otherwise sex could be physically harmful. [3] An Eliam is mentioned in 2 Samuel 23:34 as the son of Ahithophel, who is described as the Gilonite. Yet, this objection is based on some flawed premises: why is it assumed that Ahithophel needed to be older than David? Psalm 55 is a prayer of David asking God to save him from his enemies. So David's first unnamed child with Bathsheba was 7 days old when he died. From his roof, King David (reigns c. 1005965 BCE) sees beautiful Bathsheba, wife of Uriah, bathing, and he lies with her. The table below shows a summary of this information and calculations of ages for David, Ahithophel, Solomon, and Bathsheba, based on the chronology of 2 Samuel 1117. What was the age of both Bathsheba and King David when they Indeed the Talmud deduces the exact number of wives "Bath-sheba", "2 Samuel 11 - NIV Bible - In the spring, at the time when kings go off to", "Sting.com > Discography > Mad About You, 7", Current Ummah of Islam (Ummah of Muhammad), ibn Abdullah ibn Abdul-Muttalib ibn Hashim, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Bathsheba&oldid=1147580428, Short description is different from Wikidata, Wikipedia articles incorporating a citation from the 1906 Jewish Encyclopedia, Wikipedia articles incorporating a citation from the 1906 Jewish Encyclopedia without a Wikisource reference, Wikipedia articles incorporating text from the 1906 Jewish Encyclopedia, Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License 3.0, David, and Bathsheba (who is unnamed), are referenced, in the. You killed him with the sword of the Ammonites. Called Ammiel, 1 Chronicles 3:5. He betrayed David by joining Absaloms revolt. Bathsheba - Wikipedia This was also the conclusion of Jewish and Christian commentators. As shown, David was declaring that those who had betrayed him and were trying to kill him will not live out half their days. If Solomon was 11 years old at the time of Ahithophels death (the non-conservative estimate), then Bathsheba would have been around 9 years old at the time of Solomons birth. I reccommend you telling him to respond to this video. WebHe was killed by Joab (1 Chronicles 3:1-2) after he mounted a rebellion against his aging father David. This is where Psalm 55 comes in. WebSolomon is a possible heir and he has support as well, but he is only 12 years old and there is no obvious reason to prefer him over Adonijah. This is the thing that really hurt David, is that Absalom had turned against him., [35] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/psalms/55-13.html, as mine equal: i.e. The suicide of Ahithophel, and the slaughter of Absalom with so many of his followers, furnished a striking commentary on the statement.. [73] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. He hanged himself after realizing that the revolt would fail. another great academic article. Third, if Ahijah is an alternate name for Eliam, it still does not refute the claim that Eliam was the son of Ahithophel and the father of Bathsheba, simply because the Chronicler does not provide any additional information. This directly contradicts the account in 2 Samuel 17. Born: c. 1000 BCE in Bethlehem, Israel Parents: Jesse and Nitzevet (according to the This article has offered a novel contribution to the seemingly unending and unnecessary debate between Muslims and Christians on the appropriate age of marriage and the baseless criticisms of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) for his marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her). There is no doubt that, initially, many will go into denial-overdrive. However, Absalom is not named nor is he even hinted at. In this article, we have now seen blockbuster evidence of a beloved Biblical figure (~50-year old David) lusting after and marrying a young girl (~7-year old Bathsheba). The success of Absalom would probably have been fatal to Bath-sheba; it would certainly have barred Solomon, Ahithophels great-grandson, from the throne. However, he did not further complicate or solidify his adultery by marrying her. He confirmed Bathshebas words. Most, though not all, of the evidence for the age of marriage comes from outside the Bible (i.e., from outside scripture), which some Christians ignore because it is not inspired. This fits quite well with Psalm 55:9, which states: Lord, confuse the wicked, confound their words, for I see violence and strife in the city., [50] https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/16276/showrashi/true/jewish/Chapter-55.htm. From this rapid survey of the general calamity, David turns to the chief supporter of the rebellion, his former chief counsellor. The reality is that they were the most likely the same person. This article was most recently revised and updated by, https://www.britannica.com/biography/Bathsheba-biblical-figure, Jewish Women's Archive - Bathsheba: Bible, McClintock and Strong Biblical Cyclopedia - Bathsheba. Bathsheba Was King David's Most Famous Wife - Learn But, let us be even more generous and round it up to 80. 2 One evening, David got up from his couch and was pacing back and forth on the roof of the palace. The two apparently had no intentions of further complicating their sin by forming an adulterous marital union. Bathsheba was King David's most famous and controversial wife, in part because their marriage came after an illicit extramarital affair at the height of David's Yes he had her husband Uriah killed in battle then he married her. Second point, Talmud Sanhedrin 107a says she was shampooing her hair thus, negating the fact she was taking a ritual bath, as mentioned in Talmud Eruvin 4b the whole body must be in water not hair. This was also the conclusion of Jewish and Christian commentators. It is not impossible that this Eliam is the same as the preceding., [88] https://www.studylight.org/encyclopedias/mse/e/eliam.html, The same name Eliam also occurs as that of a Gilonite, the son of Ahithophel, and one of Davids thirty warriors (2 Samuel 23:34). But what if we can use the Bible to reliably estimate the age of another famous female character in the Bible: Bathsheba? [1] He was a younger brother of Shammuah David then ordered that Uriah be moved to the front-line of a battle, where he was killed. David pleaded with God to spare his child, fasting and spending the nights lying in sackcloth on the ground (2 Samuel 12:1617), but after seven days the child died (2 Samuel 12:18). King David accepted this as his punishment, went to the house of Yahweh and worshipped him (2 Samuel 12:2023). Bathsheba later gave birth to David's son Solomon. A beautiful woman, she became pregnant after David saw her bathing on a rooftop and had her brought to him. The table below shows a summary of He ordered enquiries and found out that she was Bathsheba, wife of Uriah.